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Author Topic: Electronic ignition not firing one coil....  (Read 958 times)

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Qdude

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Electronic ignition not firing one coil....
« on: June 21, 2011, 01:35:18 AM »




I saw the post on testing the "igniter" but I have some confusion as to what that is. I imagine that it is the box supplied with an aftermarket ignition that attaches to the frame and is wired between the coils and the electronic points plate.

The issue;

I have not ridden this bike since I decided to coat the tank and flush the carbs & fuel system for the rust particles. It has been at least 6 months garaged.

I got it put together and it was running rough.

Dug into it today and discovered I have lost spark to plugs 1 & 4.

The coil has 12 volts to the red/yellow.

There is no visible damage to the leads coming from the electronic points plate to the "box thing" (igniter?).
 
The dead coil sparks both plugs when I turn the key off. Now that I think of it I should have switched the green & black wires at the coil to assure that the 2 & 3 cylinder igniter wire would also operate the 1 & 4 coil, thusly determining that it is not a coil malfunction.

Do these ignition units go bad often?
This bike has had this ignition for a long time, I could check the records, but I would guess off hand it has been decades.
Could someone clarify which parts are which so I may go back to the igniter post and do the tests please?

Cheers.
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1977 C1 Green/Black
1977 C1 Blue/Bare Metal
Metro Scooter
"You can tell the size of a man by the size of the thing that makes him mad."

Qdude

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Re: Electronic ignition not firing one coil....
« Reply #1 on: June 21, 2011, 07:54:59 PM »




Bike shops here say they can get me one for about $150.oo and a couple of weeks. Online Z1 has them for $328

Dyna Ignition Z1E

I belive I only need an ignitor, but I am not sure. I will go fiddle with it now. :iconhelp:

I will check some resistances and compare them with the chart. I hope it makes sense. Perhaps I will get lucky and find a broken wire. 
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1977 C1 Green/Black
1977 C1 Blue/Bare Metal
Metro Scooter
"You can tell the size of a man by the size of the thing that makes him mad."

Qdude

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Re: Electronic ignition not firing one coil....
« Reply #2 on: June 21, 2011, 08:02:30 PM »




Ebay Dyna Ignition

Is this what I need?
Does this come with the igniter?
Can I get away with buying less, like just an igniter?   :iconhelp:
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1977 C1 Green/Black
1977 C1 Blue/Bare Metal
Metro Scooter
"You can tell the size of a man by the size of the thing that makes him mad."

rstnick

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Re: Electronic ignition not firing one coil....
« Reply #3 on: June 21, 2011, 08:39:20 PM »

Which Ignition do you have at the moment?
Points, a Kawi elec, Dyna or other?
The Kawi ignitions use an IC Igniter, the Dyna S' is built in, it does not have a separate box. The Dyna 3000 does have an Igniter box. Points, no Igniter.

Yeah, the above ebay Dyna S is would set you up, if you needed it.
« Last Edit: June 21, 2011, 08:41:17 PM by rstnick »
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Rob

KZ650.info home page with tech tips, links etc: http://kz650.info/

'77 C1 project - newest
'78 C2 Candy Apple Blue, 105 000 kms, 18" wheels front & back, Rickman fairing, Koni shocks, Progressive springs, braced stock swingarm, GSXR600 rear sets, ATK fork brace, SS brake lines, Kerker exhaust, K&N filter in air box, ported, 1st over bore, Kawi electronic ignition, bought in '84.
'78 C2 project 6 #s off other C2
'79 C3 frame with title & bits, was my brother's.

Qdude

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Re: Electronic ignition not firing one coil....
« Reply #4 on: June 21, 2011, 09:18:22 PM »



DYNA III Electronic Ignition

It has the points plate, and a separate module with these leads;
BLACK, RED; black, green; black, white; red.

There was one on both my KZ's when I bought them, and I had to replace one when I took the right side off of my green bike's engine.

New Discovery. I started switching 1 & 4, and 2 & 3's wiring to isolate what is not acting predictably.

Both coils sparked seperately when I hooked up 2 & 3's signal wire to each coil. So the coils, cables, wires, grounds, power & plugs are fine.

Dug out the wiring from the points plate to the module and switched the signal wires.

Red = power, Black = 1 & 4's spark signal, White = 2 & 3's spark signal, Green is for the oil pressure.

I switched the black & white wires, black to white & vise versa.
1 & 4 fired on 2 & 3's timing. The white wire from the points plate produces spark for either side through the module. Ergo, the module is good. I have it narrowed down to the points plate failing on the black wire.

Now, is there any way to repair the points plate? I am going to go and remove it now. I will of course mark the position carefully and check for obvious damage.

Wish me luck.










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1977 C1 Green/Black
1977 C1 Blue/Bare Metal
Metro Scooter
"You can tell the size of a man by the size of the thing that makes him mad."

Qdude

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Re: Electronic ignition not firing one coil....
« Reply #5 on: June 22, 2011, 05:15:05 AM »



I found no difference between the two sides of the plate. they were identical in all measurements with the ohm meter.

Then Nickel Poker Tuesday interrupted my work. I came out ahead, again. Gimme the Nickels. Boy was I beered up. My friends Girl can chug beer quickly (3 seconds), but I edged her out by at least a half second. Thank you Kokanee. Next week is Persian BBQ (thank you Bijan), I will supply the Margaritas. You are all invited. Especially you Gd4now in Seattle, my treat. Then I will take more Nickels.  :iconraspberry: :hello: :iconcrazy:

I hope that upon re-installation the unit will once again transmit the poo again. Until then, I will consider stealing the plate from my other bike that is awaiting Australian clutch rubbers. Juheez I wanna ride again... :dance:

Happy Summer Solstice all. May we commence now the shorter days towards earth winter sleep in harmony and balance without vomiting. May I remember yesterday tomorrow. Call your Mother....   :-&
« Last Edit: June 22, 2011, 05:19:24 AM by Qdude »
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1977 C1 Green/Black
1977 C1 Blue/Bare Metal
Metro Scooter
"You can tell the size of a man by the size of the thing that makes him mad."

Qdude

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Re: Electronic ignition not firing one coil....
« Reply #6 on: June 22, 2011, 07:23:59 PM »




I am going to mount the plate and see if there is signal that I may measure.
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1977 C1 Green/Black
1977 C1 Blue/Bare Metal
Metro Scooter
"You can tell the size of a man by the size of the thing that makes him mad."

Qdude

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Re: Electronic ignition not firing one coil....
« Reply #7 on: June 23, 2011, 06:42:32 PM »




Ronery, Yep. A rittle ronery..    :((
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1977 C1 Green/Black
1977 C1 Blue/Bare Metal
Metro Scooter
"You can tell the size of a man by the size of the thing that makes him mad."

Qdude

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Re: Electronic ignition not firing one coil....
« Reply #8 on: June 24, 2011, 06:54:40 PM »




Got it to work...

Now back to messing with the carbs...
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1977 C1 Green/Black
1977 C1 Blue/Bare Metal
Metro Scooter
"You can tell the size of a man by the size of the thing that makes him mad."
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